With membership at new lows and no electoral wins to their name, it’s time for the Greens to ditch the malignant narcissist who’s presided over its decline.

"How has Stein fared as a leader? By AOC’s perfectly reasonable standard, she’s done abysmally. As of July 2024, a mere 143 officeholders in the United States are affiliated with the Green Party. None of them are in statewide or federal offices. In fact, no Green Party candidate has ever won federal office. And Stein’s reign has been a period of indisputable decline, during which time the party’s membership—which peaked in 2004 at 319,000 registered members—has fallen to 234,000 today.

This meager coalition can’t possibly kick-start a legitimate political movement, capable of organizing voters and advancing ideas outside of perennial electoral events. It’s just large enough, however, to spoil the work of those who put in this kind of work."

  • cabbage@piefed.socialEnglish
    91·
    6 months ago

    It’s a two party system. Everybody knows if you run as a third party you’re merely increasing the chances that the ones furthest from you politically will be elected.

    It’s impossible for a third party candidate to be running for president in the US in good faith unless they’re complete fucking idiots with no idea how the political system works.

    Jill Stein knows how the system works. So obviously she’s not acting in good faith.

    Simple as that.

    • chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world
      31·
      6 months ago

      Seems like you beat the coin flip today, and people agree with you. Watch out, next time the Libertarians and Communists will tell you that just getting on the ballot is enough to make a dent in the two party system…

      • cabbage@piefed.socialEnglish
        4·
        6 months ago

        It’s a thread about the Green Party, those trolls don’t bother coming here. The third party enthusiasts only show up for the Harris threads.

        …speaking of good faith.

      • captainlezbian@lemmy.world
        3·
        6 months ago

        The communist party of the United States has consistently refused to run candidates for major offices very specifically to avoid spoiling the vote.

          • LustyArgonian@lemmy.worldEnglish
            0·
            6 months ago

            I am a leftist and I celebrate everyone’s right to vote how they please. If people would like to hear my reasons for voting for Kamala, or my concerns about third party spoiling, I can tell them. But a person’s right to vote is more important to me than how they vote. That’s what democracy and being for the people is about. Use your rights, I support that. We all deserve to use our rights.

            • pooperNickel@lemm.ee
              1·
              6 months ago

              What an insufferable position and way of arguing for it. To anyone reading this thread, she only gets worse with each reply. She’s arguing for… Literally Everything necessarily taking a backseat to protecting people from even the mere concept of them feeling like their voting rights are taken away. Despite the fact that no one in this thread is trying to do that, and only Republicans are ever interested in such a thing, she’s really oddly interested in making sure people vote for third parties, which helps Republicans, without ever hearing the truth about third parties because it might hurt their feelings. Which as we all know, is definitely taking their voting rights away.

              She undoubtedly will point out some out of context quote about how the rational person in this discussion is a fAsCisT but each time she did that previously in the thread below, she wasn’t doing it in good faith so you be the judge.

              • LustyArgonian@lemmy.worldEnglish
                0·
                6 months ago

                You realize your strawman here is a bad faith argument? In fact, I actually can’t find a single good faith argument in anything you’ve written. You start out with an appeal to emotion. Then strawman. Then no true scotsman. Then strawman. Then strawman. Then strawman. Also we all know you’re the “”“rational”“” other person on an alt account. You type the same and it’s been days since anyone responded to this thread. Lol.

                I am voting for Kamala and I’m perfectly happy to tell people why. Maybe people will agree with me and that’s great. Otherwise, I still support someone’s right to vote no matter how they vote. Because that’s what a right is, and that’s what the right to vote grants. I disagree with any speech that advocates for limiting the right to vote, particularly because I’m a woman and women’s rights are being taken away actively.

                I also think that while yes, obviously Jill Stein is a Russian asset, that doesn’t mean every independent or third party candidate is. I am on the side of the every day person and am fine with hearing criticisms of Dems and of the way we currently vote.

                I will point out any speech that is a dog whistle to eroding our rights, though. I’ve quoted the specific issues with what you said. I don’t really need to say more. I accept you think it’s fine to control others. I accept that you refuse to learn about civil rights and the right to vote. I accept that you refuse to analyze propaganda and dog whistles in your speech. Whatever, it’s your opinion. I also think your little comment serves as an advertisement anyway for any people reading this thread besides you, lol.

                • pooperNickel@lemm.ee
                  1·
                  6 months ago

                  Quite conspiratorial to think I’m that other person… do you do that? Why would you even think that people would go through the trouble? Weird.

                  I will point out any speech that is a dog whistle to eroding our rights, though.

                  More conspiratorial thinking. in any case it’s pretty ridiculous to try and tell someone they shouldn’t inform people about third parties because they might get their feelings hurt and then… Feel unable to vote or something?

            • chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world
              0·
              6 months ago

              I’m not sure you could be more milquetoast if you tried. Sure, it’s important that everyone has the right to vote. It is equally as important that everyone understand that unless they vote one of two ways, their vote is essentially going to waste at best, and going against their best interests at worse. A vote for a third party candidate is a vote cast against your closest aligned Democrat or Republican candidate. A vote not cast for them is cast against them. That’s just the way the system works. It sucks. I hate it. I want to change it, but wishful thinking isn’t fixing the problem, and until its fixed, voting third party is a net loss for the voter. That’s the shitty reality of it. People that tell you to vote third party are either idiots, or malicious, and no one should be listening to either of those groups when it comes to voting for the future of the country. Work on changing the system first, then cast the vote you want to cast.

              • LustyArgonian@lemmy.worldEnglish
                0·
                6 months ago

                It’s not “equally important.” No, the right to vote is more important. Period.

                Sure, your perspective and how you and many others view this election, is that it’s important to vote for either Kamala or Trump. But that’s your perspective. Totally fine to discuss but it doesn’t supercede the literal civil right to vote. Or to run for office.

                Today and yesterday, I’ve seen people advocate for removing the right to vote and run for office here on Lemmy. I’ve seen people use the word “disenfranchised” wrong. Our civil rights are actively in jeopardy - see: abortion access. People being confused on how important voting rights are and what that means is BAD. I have seen a LOT of fascist rhetoric lately. It is NOT leftwing or radical or progressive to be fascist and deny people their vote just because you dislike it. It is NOT leftwing or radical or progressive to deny people the right to run for office because it makes another party’s job harder. That is actually literally fascism. What the fuck.

                And again, I’m voting for Kamala. I generally agree with your reasoning. I do not agree with the messaging or the idea that people should be forced into thinking and voting like me.

                • chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world
                  0·
                  6 months ago

                  Totally fine to discuss but it doesn’t supersedes the literal civil right to vote. Or to run for office.

                  By that logic, the right to own a gun supersedes the need to be educated on how they work. “Here’s a loaded 9mm, Timmy. I’m sure you can figure the rest out.”

                  I do not agree with the messaging or the idea that people should be forced into thinking and voting like me.

                  And I’m not saying that anyone should be forced to vote any one way. Vote however you want, but being educated on how it works is just as important as the act itself. If every voter were educated on the system and understood how it worked, then we wouldn’t have third party candidates. Actually, strike that, we would have them. We wouldn’t have this first past the post bullshit we do now, and third party candidates would have a chance at being elected if they represent the will of the majority.

                  Untl we have that, though, people should understand that voting doesn’t work how they want it to, it works how it works. If you want to feed your family by fishing with cheetos, go for it, but don’t tell everyone else that if we all fish with cheetos suddenly fish will take the bait. The nature of the beast is that we vote in a two party system, and we will until we change it at a fundamental level. The fact that we have people saying that third party voting is a viable option tells me that there is a lot of misinformation and a strong lack of education in our voting populace.

      • barsquid@lemmy.world
        2·
        6 months ago

        Guys as soon as we’ve got 5% popular vote we get on the ballots automatically. That prevents unavoidable blockers like how our own campaign fucked up the paperwork! It will be all over for these fuckers, we will win it for certain after that.

    • fluxion@lemmy.worldEnglish
      1·
      6 months ago

      There’s room for 3rd party candidates who have principals that voters cant compare candidates and not let the 2 party system shift in whatever direction it wants as soon as the 2 parties start racing to the bottom. But if you accept Putin’s money and influence it is your party who is racing to the bottom and you have no principles so that’s when you become a useless drain.

    • pooperNickel@lemm.ee
      1·
      6 months ago

      Everybody capable of rational thought knows that. However there are plenty of tankie douchebags who would love to tell you what a wrong ShItLiB you are for saying this basic truth

  • HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.worldEnglish
    4·
    6 months ago

    When I was a teenager and foolish and a republican, we campaigned for the green party because we thought we could trick democrats into voting green but we’d never get them to vote republican. make of that what you will.

    • halcyoncmdr@lemmy.worldEnglish
      1·
      6 months ago

      It’s literally one of the things they do every election. This isn’t new. Or even news. Unless people were living under a rock, or blind.

      Just like Russia, China, etc help any misinformation and disinformation campaign they can all over the world in other countries. All chaos is good for them in the end. Even if their ideal candidate doesn’t win, the bickering they help stole makes it harder for other countries to rally very well against their interests.

      It’s the same reason the US has done the same shit all over as well. Promoting and supporting coups is a national passtime because it helps the US indirectly either way.

  • Thrillhouse@lemmy.world
    3·
    6 months ago

    It makes total sense for Russia to make Jill Stein a Russian asset because it neutralizes an anti-oil organization. Oil is very important to Russia’s economy so of course they don’t want any phase-out of fossil fuels.

    • chakan2@lemmy.worldEnglish
      0·
      6 months ago

      It’s much more simple. If Trump wins, Russia gets the Ukraine. Putin put the war in motion thinking Trump was a sure bet last election.

      It why Trump is trying to pull us out of all our treaties. I think he gives Putin a run at all of Europe possibly.

  • Chapelgentry@lemmynsfw.comEnglish
    1·
    6 months ago

    Wait, the Green Party only had 300k members at it’s peak? That’s 0.001% of the American population. Why are all the tankies in here talking about how voting for Stein will make a difference? That’s not even enough to consider her a contender in most states, much less for the whole country.

    • dubyakay@lemmy.ca
      1·
      6 months ago

      (319,000 / 293,000,000) * 100 = ~0.11%

      Not 0.001%. Unless you were just overexaggerating their insignificance on purpose. However that’s then potentially 319k less voters for the Dems.

    • ArxCyberwolf@lemmy.ca
      0·
      6 months ago

      Because they can smugly claim to have accomplished something with their vote while the country burns around them. Must be nice not being at risk under a Trump administration.

    • jordanlund@lemmy.worldOPM
      0·
      6 months ago

      Hey, at their peak, when Nader was running in 2000 and Bush was installed as President by the Supreme Court, the Greens got 2.7% of the vote!

      The best they’ve done since then is Stein in 2016 with 1.07%.

      Generally, they’re 0.1%, 0.3%. In that range.

      • ansiz@lemmy.worldEnglish
        1·
        6 months ago

        People forget, but I’m the 70’s Nader was so feared by the DC elite that Nixon repeatedly complained about him on the Nixon tapes. Nader would have been a good president based on his record of advocating for citizens over corporations.

  • nilloc@discuss.tchncs.deEnglish
    0·
    6 months ago

    I think Ralph Nader killed it when he helped get us Bush and the war criminals.

    Jill just figured out the Putin would pay to reanimate its corpse.

    • jordanlund@lemmy.worldOPM
      1·
      6 months ago

      The Green Party really didn’t exist before Nader. There was a loose coalition of state Green parties that united under Nader in 1996. But the idea of a national Green party wouldn’t happen until 2001.

  • sumguyonline@lemmy.world
    01·
    6 months ago

    Unless dems and reps cheat. Green party is doing better this election simply because Harris is a drug Barron, and Trump is a shiester. This article is their windbags blowing because people aren’t gobbling up their plates of human shit and voting for it… What comes next is gonna blow some peoples minds(figuratively ofcourse).

  • BaumGeist@lemmy.ml
    01·
    6 months ago

    It’s just large enough, however, to spoil the work of those who put in this kind of work.

    The big 2 parties haven’t put in more effort, they’ve just put in more person-hours… Because they have more people. Parties aren’t more worthy of votes based solely on how many people are voting for them, that’s tyranny of the majority. And if they can adapt their platforms to appeal to the small portion of undecided defectors from their primary rival party (each other), they damn sure can tailor their platform to the 100,000s that vote independent/3rd party.

    Checking biases, the only other article by this contributor is explaining why it’s actually A Good Thing™ that the Harris campaign doesn’t explain their platform in depth… You know, like you would want a leader to do if you were subject to their rules and policies for any length of time.

    Once again, the liberals are quick to assign blame for any of their shortcomings, and it’s just coincidentally never their fault nor responsibility to do anything. Their primary guiding principal for decades has been to change the status quo as little as possible to ensure they can’t be blamed for the changes, while accusing everyone else of destroying democracy.

  • some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org
    01·
    6 months ago

    Reactionary people are unable to accept that some of us are socialists who have an absolute fear of more orange bad. I love where I live and planned to stay the rest of my life, but will be forced (by my own standards and fear) to leave the country if he returns to office.

  • jimmydoreisalefty@lemmy.world
    13·
    6 months ago

    ITT: Blue MAGA and preaching to the choir.

    Dr. Jill Stein has improved the Green Party; y’all just believe anything the duopoly and owner-class media spit out when it agrees with your thinking.

    Muslim support is at an all-time high for Dr. Jill Stein; that is why AOCPelosi, the new attack dog of Blue MAGA, started up again.

    I suggest getting out of the echo chambers and checking out independent journalists instead of continuing the self-censorship.

    • barsquid@lemmy.world
      2·
      6 months ago

      Oh it’s our resident “independent journalism” guy who seems to post nothing but far-right podcasts.

    • ALostInquirer@lemm.ee
      1·
      6 months ago

      Dr. Jill Stein has improved the Green Party; y’all just believe anything the duopoly and owner-class media spit out when it agrees with your thinking.

      In what ways, alongside the one point mentioned, and according to what sources (presumably not from the party itself)?

    • anticolonialist@lemmy.world
      12·
      6 months ago

      The greater part of the population is not very intelligent, dreads responsibility, and desires nothing better than to be told what to do. Provided the rulers do not interfere with its material comforts and its cherished beliefs, it is perfectly happy to let itself be ruled.

      ~Aldous Huxley

      • shalafi@lemmy.worldEnglish
        1·
        6 months ago

        Wow! Never read that quote. Perfectly explains how American politics got to be such a mess. I laugh at all the revolutionary talk around here.

        material comforts

        Yeah, no, we’re so well-fed we have to find excuses for our rampant obesity. There won’t be a revolution until people are literally fighting for food and our masters will never allow that to come to pass. Look at lemmy, bitching and moaning about video game prices and such. We’re pretty fucking far from lacking material comforts. To add, a lot of people think they’re suffering, but haven’t seen a day of true poverty in their lives. Y’all, you’re suffering in comparison to what could and should be.

        cherished beliefs

        As fast as we in the West are dropping religion, notice the politicians haven’t done anything about the rampant sex abuse? Taxing the church? Unheard of! Let the masses have their silly beliefs, stick to the middle of the road if you must, get elected again.

  • SeattleRain@lemmy.worldEnglish
    03·
    6 months ago

    She’s going to spoil the election for Harris libs! There’s nothing you can do about it, except stop your genocide is Gaza.

    • Soup@lemmy.cafeEnglish
      1·
      6 months ago

      Such commitment to the bit! Love how you encapsulated the sheer ignorance and downright avoidance of reality of typical leftists here in just a few short sentences!

      You’ve got a career in comedy ahead of you!