So I’ve got a goofy issue tuning my block bench plane. It’s one of the Pony Jorgensen #4 smoothing planes they’re selling at Lowe’s in the States. Works pretty well with one exception: Moving the frog forward to bring the iron closer to the mouth also advances the iron.
I can’t get it anywhere near as closed as you’re supposed to with a smoothing plane before I can’t retract the iron sufficiently. The mating surface in the sole that the frog rests on is slightly angled downward, so the frog is lowered as it is moved forward. I can’t realistically bring the iron any farther on the chip breaker than I’ve got it.
As I had it apart, I noticed the finish on the bottom of the frog, the surface that mates with the sole, was as cast, it isn’t machined or lapped. Should it be?
There are 3 ways to improve the cut on a smoother. 1 close the mouth 2 increase the cutting angle 3 adjust the chipbreaker close.
None of them are magic bullets, and for the most part you have to use one of them. Sometimes you can use mostly one and a little bit of another, but if you max out all 3 you’ll have a badly choking mouth.
I’m actually getting a remarkably good finish off of this plane as-is, I used hard maple for the supports of the drawer-with-secret-compartment I posted a bit ago, and I don’t think my cornea has a smoother finish than that maple. My understanding is, closing the mouth can prevent chip-out around figured grain especially in crunchy wood like oak.
But before we get there, I need to be able to successfully set up the plane first. If I move the frog forward to close the mouth, it also increases the depth of cut, and it increases beyond what the depth adjustment knob can retract. It hits the end of travel before it retracts the iron completely. Even with the frog back, I have to have the chip breaker set very close to the cutting edge just to be able to sufficiently retract it.
Noticing the cast surface on the bottom of the frog (which mates with a machined surface on the sole) I’m wondering if I’ve got a defective plane.
If you look at this video around the 20 minute mark, he disassembles the same make/model plane I have and the bottom of the frog clearly has machining marks.
Here is the surface of mine, showing the same cast surface as most of the rest of its surface, in stark contrast to the machined iron bedding surface. Should I lap this, contact Jorgensen to complain…?
Return the plane.
Not sure where you are and what is available to you but personally (for iron body planes) I prefer the better quality ones from the first half of the 20th century.
I don’t think Lowe’s would take a return at this point, I’ve had and used the plane for about a year, and just now noticed the as-cast surface. I’ve sent a line to Jorgensen, we’ll see if they do anything about it.
Try setting it up with the mouth at about 1/16" and the chipbreaker really close to the edge
Depth of cut is too deep at maximum retraction. I think the chip breaker is slightly too long for the mouth to be that closed. I might grind it a little shorter at some point. I can’t fully retract the iron unless the mouth is 1/8" or more
Does the blade have multiple notches to allow adjustment as you sharpen it? Are you using the notch that makes the blade shortest?
No notches. Well, one notch. It’s a pretty much standard Sanley-Bailey pattern bench plane. Here, I’ll show you how it works.
Here’s the iron (blade) by itself. That long slot is ultimately what allows you to adjust for sharpening. It attaches to another piece of metal called the cap iron or chip breaker like this:
With a screw through the back:
The chip breaker has two functions here: the very tip sits flush against the front of the blade just behind the cutting edge so that when the shaving meets it, it is curled forward causing the cellulose fibers to snap and stop any wedging action. This has the effect of rolling the shavings into curls in a way that bevel up planes tend not to. It also interfaces with the depth of cut adjuster on the plane.
Here is the sole and frog assembly:
On a simpler plane like a block plane, the iron would rest on a machined surface built into the sole (the main body of the plane), a bench plane like this has an adjustment feature for setting the blade not only deeper or shallower, but forward and backward to control the size of opening the shavings will emerge through. The wedge shaped thing the blade rests on is called a frog, apparently named after a structure in a horse’s hoof with a similar shape. The depth of cut adjustment is a screw operated lever, you can see the top of the lever poking through in the above image just below the disc shaped thing near the top (that’s part of the lateral adjuster). The iron and chip breaker assembly mounts on the plane like so:
The chip breaker is on top with the iron sandwiched between it and the frog. The depth adjustment lever pokes up through that long slot in the iron and catches that notch in the chip breaker. As the user turns an adjustment wheel on the back of the frog, it tilts that lever which causes the iron and chip breaker assembly to slide up and down the face of the frog, advancing and retracting the cutting edge through the sole.
One last part, the lever cap:
Some have a toggle lever at the top, this one has a thumb screw, either way what that does is pinch the iron and chip breaker assembly against the frog by putting tension on that screw that sticks up through the middle of it all. Changing the tension there changes how hard it is to move the depth of cut or lateral adjust.
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At least on this particular plane and I assume on other similar ones, the mating surface between the frog and the sole is angled downward, so moving the frog forward also moves it downward, which advances the depth of cut. So to move the iron forward/close the mouth, you would have to also retract the iron with the depth of cut knob. Except with the frog adjusted forward, the depth adjuster hits its limit of travel before the iron is retracted far enough. I’ve got the iron choked up about as far as I can reasonably go on the chip breaker, which makes me think the chip breaker would need to be shortened to operate this plane like that, since I can’t make the blade shorter than the chip breaker.
And while investigating this I found the bottom surface of the frog isn’t machined. Been using it for a year like that so I suppose it’s not that critical but still.
first question: do you really need to do/fix anything. Everything you have said could just mean you fail in some bragging contest, but the plane works just fine. If the plane works for the wood you are working with then don’t worry about showing off how closed a mouth you can get. If you choose wood well you don’t need the plane as perfectly setup. Now onto your question:
It doesn’t need to be smooth, but smoother surfaces make find adjustments easier (sometimes possible at all) so you want it smooth enough.
I haven’t used that plane, but in general the things you buy at a box store are not great tools. I’d use it for wood where I expect to encounter nails or rocks (if you are using a smoother that better not happen, but for some rough wood it might). Then spend 5-10x the price on a good plane from a major brand… If you can’t afford a good plane (great used ones pop up at garage sales all the time), I’d contact hock tools (or other custom blade maker) about getting new blade made of quality steel. The cutting blade on cheap tools is often a really bad alloy and cannot be made good. A blade in O1 or A2 steel (there are other good choices and it often seems more like a religious debate than anything of facts when people discuss: choose something) with a good sharpening system (even more religious than the blade alloy discussions) will solve a lot of problems.
Seriously, start with a good quality blade and a good sharpening system. You will spend more than the plane on a good blade, and probably twice that on a good sharpening system. However this will be your best investments. A sharpening system will last a lifetime, and if you decide the plane is hopeless your new blade will fit whatever you buy to replace it.
Do I really need to do/fix anything? I suppose not, it’s been working pretty well for about a year now.
On price…100 years ago, a Stanley #4 smoothing plane cost about $4.20, adjusting for inflation that comes out to be about $77. Which is pretty much bang on the price of a Jorgensen #4 here, and I think I’ve got a tool of equivalent quality. The iron it came with is O1 tool steel which does take and hold a keen edge from my diamond plate.
I’ve used it for about a year before I noticed the frog-to-sole mating surface isn’t machined. I think I’m gonna contact Jorgensen about that, see if they’ll send me a new frog, failing that I might just lap it myself.
