I just finished season 1. I don’t understand the hype. I liked it and the cast is fantastic but so far I think that the plots, arcs, and dialog aren’t anything special. Imdb says there are nine noble families. Nine? That a silly amount of stuff to keep track of. I feel like I’ll need a conspiracy theory like board with red string so I can keep track of everything. But that’s more of a commitment than I want to make.

And I was surprised that there’s some formulaic stuff make reddit and reddit-like audience cheer. The fucking scenes seem almost funny to me. They are so fake and wooden. I assume the wolf dogs are in the books but in season 1 - they seem less scary and more like a cool plot device.

At Imdb it has a rating of 9.2/10 • 2.2m. I can’t believe it has millions of ratings but it’s still above 9. I think the series is has an effectively higher rating than The Sopranos which is 9.2/10 but it only has has 1/5th has many ratings.

  1. How can it be so highly rated?

  2. What would you rate the series as a whole?

  3. Why do people love this series so much?

  4. Is season 1 typical of the series? Worse? Better?

  5. How do you rank the seasons best to worst?

  6. Is there more dialog that needs subtitles? I don’t like that at all. I don’t want to read subtitles for a fantasy series.

  7. Is the finale even worse than The Sopranos’?

  • zifnab25 [he/him, any]@hexbear.net
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    1 year ago

    The first three books were incredible, and I think a lot of the show gets a knock-on effect from GRRM’s original fan-base. In the same way that a Batman movie gets a good 2-3+ bump from comic book nerds, GoT is buoyed by folks that are enthusiastic about the original material on screen.

    Like you said, the acting is stellar, although I don’t feel like the younger main cast really hits their stride until S2/S3. I think the adaption, particularly for the first series, is a bit weak and rushed. You lose a lot of the inner monologues and flashbacks that make the perspective-based storytelling so compelling. Instead, you get the periodic (s)expository, where some supporting actor explains the plot to the mains. The visuals definitely improve over seasons (until the big drop-off in S8), although it still never gets to AAA motion picture quality.

    I think the best seasons in the series are actually where they depart from the books - S4, 5, 6 - and aren’t bound to a writing formula that stumbles in conversion to TV. The main cast is very into the material. The set designs are truly top notch. The wardrobe is particularly stunning. You really have to just stop and soak in those incredible fits.

    But I also think GoT is something of a victim of its own success. One of the big appeals of the story and setting is in how it delivers on a dark and gritty medieval setting with periodic twists that catch you off guard in the moment but seem natural enough in hindsight. The amount of intrigue and politics GoT delivers on - particularly in the period when it was being released - resonated with the historical moment. People really were ready to believe Change Was Coming (one way or another). The overarching conflict between morality and practicality in an era when these were genuinely seen as political conversations worth having rang true in the moment. And a lot of subsequent franchises picked up on this, chopping and screwing the underlying story arcs into your Better Call Sauls and Stars War and Marvel shows, until they no longer felt fresh and original.

    As to the finale? You shut your damn face about the Sporanos. That ending was spot on.

    But whatever you thought of it, this was significantly worse. Everything from the screenwriting to the cinematography takes a huge plunge. There are scenes where you can’t see what’s on the damned screen because they didn’t light it properly. There are scenes where characters mysteriously teleport from location to location without any sensible explanation. There are scenes where you can practically see the actors delivering the lines groan with their clumbsiness.

    There’s a notable step down from S6 to S7, in so far as the pacing picks up and they start craming more “What a twist!” moments into scenes than is comfortably paced. But they’re wrapping things up and that’s somewhat forgiveable. But S8 falls straight off a cliff. It genuinely ruins the entire franchise with how bad it lands.

  • TheLepidopterists [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    1 year ago

    Imdb says there are nine noble families. Nine?

    Depending on the point in the series they’re counting from, this is probably the most prestigious houses, but it’d be like saying there are three political dynasties in the US, Bush, Clinton and Kennedy- there are a ton of less prestigious ones who are mostly vassals to the big ones.

    As to your numbered questions it’s been forever since I saw it so it’s difficult but I’ll try to answer:

    1. I think people like the huge web of political alliances and back stabbing and conflicting interests. Plus the costuming, effects and music are all pretty good.

    2. If you like seeing nobles scheme against each other it’s top of class, otherwise no reason to watch I guess, sorry that this isn’t a number/10. It would be better without some of the gratuitous sex scenes though, which is another reason one may not like it. cw:

    spoiler

    especially the violent ones

    1. Same answer as 1, kinda the same question

    2. Season 1 is better than the later seasons but IIRC it hits its stride in the midseasons?

    3. (2-4 [or 5, don’t remember])>1>6+ (but some of the music in the later seasons was pretty good and the effects remained awesome).

    4. Characters do sometimes speak Dothraki or Valyrian. Also I just watch everything with subtitles so I don’t really notice it now, it might be like, a lot of it? Also need help understanding nonce island accents sometimes.

    5. I haven’t seen the Sopranos but the finale is pretty bad.

  • Anchorite@lemm.ee
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    1 year ago

    It started what, over a decade ago? Think about it in context, it was the first fantasy show to be given a huge budget and weight behind it, the first to be given the ‘prestige television HBO’ treatment.

    Don’t feel like you need to make a huge commitment, it’s fairly focused and you can take what you want from it.

    Don’t care about the hype at all, people who make media their personality are not who you want to emulate, enjoy it or don’t it’s entertainment

  • PKMKII [none/use name]@hexbear.net
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    1 year ago

    I think the show resonated with a lot of people because it didn’t fit into the stereotypical, moralistic good vs evil clash story that LOTR standardized for fantasy. The backstabbing, the realpolitik, the anti-fairy tale aspects, people liked that it put those prestige drama elements into the fantasy genre.

    Overall, it’s stronger in the middle seasons, but loses itself once the show hits the point that they were past the novels and were working off of Martin’s notes on how he plans to finish the series. Both because they couldn’t crib from his writing, but also because the differences between the novels’ version of the narrative and the show’s version had digressed so much that they couldn’t reconcile the ending with where the show was, and their solution was, well, there’s a reason the last season got lambasted by the fans. So if it’s not appealing to you now, that’s only going to get worse by the end.

  • duderium [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    1 year ago

    I’m a fan of both the books and the series but I don’t care if people dislike it (since I like to think that I’m not treat-brained even though I am) and I also think there are plenty of weird problems with it, namely that the grimdark subgenre basically serves to justify the shittiness of our own world (“things could be worse, just look at GoT!”). I won’t spoil the ending for you but it definitely comes out very strongly against the idea that anything can actually get better. I’ve also realized lately that ethnic minorities which were very much present in medieval Europe (Jews, Roma) just don’t exist in GoT. We have the Dothraki, who are basically Mongols, and then some occasional vague references to darker skin that GRRM makes in the books now and then. That’s pretty much it? There are references to diversity and different languages, but minority groups are rarely if ever mentioned to be living in a massive city like King’s Landing for instance. As a Marxist it also frustrates me that the economic base for Westeros is barely depicted. Peasants either don’t exist or are passive, weak, on the run, etcetera, even though that is also historically inaccurate. We get some slave liberation in the series but the slaves themselves are also extremely passive.(It’s easy to say that “it’s just fantasy” in response but w/e.) GRRM definitely has better politics than Tolkien but he’s obviously not a Marxist.

    That being said, for all his faults and annoyances, as a writer I am generally very impressed with GRRM’s abilities. His wealth of detail and dedication to complex characters, neverending conflict, and somehow managing to keep things interesting for thousands of pages (“and then things got worse,” tightening the screws for chapter after chapter after chapter)—it’s all really unrivaled IMO. Just randomly mercing main characters is also kind of funny, I have to admit, and really keeps readers on their toes—I don’t think it upsets them as much as in other series, either (Star Wars Disneyverse for instance) since they get kind of used to it?

  • BabaIsPissed [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    1 year ago

    1 - Some of the appeal of the books is present in the series, specially early seasons, so there’s that. More cynically, it’s probably the first instance of medieval fantasy prestige TV (I know there was other stuff like Pillars of the Earth and whatnot but those didn’t have the HBO brand) so there was some novelty to it. Borrowing from Lindsay Ellis, it’s “hot fantasy that FUCKS”. It’s juvenile as all hell and eyeroll inducing but it was key to marketing it to general audiences.

    2 - decent 7 while it was running because of the whole social aspect and no hindsight of how shit it was going to get, light 3 now, and a 0 if you’re in any way averse to gratuitous violence/sex.

    3 - I think the appeal of the books that transfers to the series is a) some of the characters and b) the politicking.

    The problem with the characters is that they get flanderized to all hell later on, or sometimes it becomes clear the showrunners didn’t really understand them, or at least didn’t know what to do with them. But still, some of them are compelling, even if they are fucking assholes.

    I think the core appeal of GoT though is seeing an inflection point in the history of this fictional world. Not because there’s wars going on, but because characters like Jon and Daenarys (not coincidentally fan favorites) are struggling to surpass the “might makes right” world they live in, and sometimes succeeding. Also because of the growing presence of supernatural shit. It gives this feeling of this new world peeking in and all the promise and terror that comes with this kind of change. The show fumbles both os these aspects REALLY hard later on though. That’s because it bought into the “dark fantasy” meme and played down the supernatural aspects (nerd shit) and made a U turn back to the status quo (the last few episodes reek of liberalism).

    4 - Typical to early seasons in some ways in the sense that it borrows heavily from the books, but the focus shifts to war stuff so there’s some distinction there.

    5 - it’ been a while since I’ve seen the series, but seasons 1-4 are pretty decent, 5 is okayish, 6 was pretty bad and 7-8 are atrocious.

    6 - Dunno, not a native speaker. I was fine with subtitles off most of the time though.

    7 - Haven’t watched The Sopranos yet, but GoT has probably one of the worst endings I’ve ever seen.

  • nat_turner_overdrive [he/him]@hexbear.net
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    1 year ago

    I enjoyed the first like four or five seasons well enough.

    Imdb says there are nine noble families. Nine? That a silly amount of stuff to keep track of. I feel like I’ll need a conspiracy theory like board with red string so I can keep track of everything. But that’s more of a commitment than I want to make.

    I had read the first book and sort of categorized it as a fantasy series for people who like making charts. There’s just a certain type of fantasy reader who seems to really enjoy referencing and/or making character charts to remember whose cousin did what and married who, and GoT is right in that wheelhouse. To be clear, there’s nothing wrong with that, but it doesn’t work for me personally, and sometimes I think that level of complexity is a writing crutch or distraction from some kind of lack in other departments.